ONE GOD, JESUS CHRIST ! (1 Corinthian 8:6)
“I Corinthian 8:6 yet for us there is
but ONE GOD the Father, from whom are all things and we exist for
Him; and one Lord, Jesus Christ, by whom are all things, and we exist
through Him.”
'ONE GOD, Jesus Christ' !
ONE God the FATHER, or, ONE God and
Father of ALL (Eph.4:6). Yet for us is but ONE God the Father (1 Cor.
8:6).
Jesus Christ said that He is the Father
(John 10:30), (John 14:9 and Isa. 63:16).
The Prophet Isaiah has foretold that
the Lord Jesus Christ is the everlasting Father (Isa. 9:6).
In (Jer. 3:19), the Lord Jesus Christ
said, “I said, that you shall call Me, My Father and not turning
away from following Me.”
NO! There isn't one person called God
and another person called Lord. It is God who is the Lord
(Deuteronomy 7:9), and He is the ONLY God our saviour (Jude 1:25).
In (Isa. 43:10 – 12) the Lord Jesus
said, “You are My witnesses, declares the Lord Jesus, and My
servant whom I have chosen, so that you may know and believe Me and
understand that I am He, before Me there was no God formed, and there
will be none after Me.”
And neither is there ONE God called
Yahweh or Jehovah “from whom are all things and we exist for Him”.
The Scriptures said that ALL things was
made by the Lord Jesus Christ and NOTHING came into being apart from
the Lord Jesus Christ (John 1:3-10 and Col. 1:15-20).
It is a fallacy to believe and teach
that 1 Corinthian 8:6 teaches that there is one God called Yahweh or
Jehovah “from whom are all things”, when the Scriptures clearly
teaches that all
things were created by the Lord Jesus
Christ and for the Lord Jesus Christ and nothing came into being
apart from the Lord Jesus Christ (John 1:3-10 and Col. 1:15 - 20).
And it is equally erroneous to believe
and teach that a god called Yahweh or Jehovah who sent a man called
Jesus to create the heavens and the earth.
The Scriptures said in (Jude 1:25) 'To
the only GOD who is our SAVIOUR'.
The Scriptures does NOT say that there
is one person called 'GOD' and another person called SAVIOUR.
To the contrary, Jude 1:25 said that
the saviour Jesus Christ is the only God.
So, 1 Corinthian 8:6 means, 'Yet for us
there is but ONE GOD and that is Jesus Christ who made ALL things and
we exist for Him, and everything was made by that ONE God who is the
LORD Jesus Christ and we were created by Him'.
Do you believe that the Scriptures
teaches that the Lord Jesus Christ is God ?
All comments are welcome, for and
against.
Please let me hear your thoughts.
Add Your Comment(62)
ONE GOD, JESUS CHRIST ! (1 Corinthian 8:6)Posted by Paul G Sunday, July 24, 2016
After reading many creeds and belief statements
I decided to stick to my own
62 Comments:
'yet for us there is One God, the Father, FROM Whom are all things and FOR Whom we exist, and one Lord, Jesus Christ, THROUGH Whom are all things and THROUGH Whom we exist'
1 Corinthians ch. 8 v. 6
The From Whom and the For Whom speak about God the Father Who brought things into being, and the Through Whom speaks about the Son Whom the Father used to do this.
Very clear to understand Paul
'Clear to understand' Brenda ?
Obviously NOT !
You and all trinitarians believe that there are TWO entities (gods), from whom are all things and through whom we exist.
Totally against the Scriptures and the creator of heaven and earth (Isa. 44:24 and 45:18).
Your thought and interpretation of the Scriptures is polytheistic, meaning that you believe in many gods just like the trinitarians.
As I have said in a previous comment, that your interpretation of the Scriptures is worse than those of the trinitarians.
The same confusion, but you are even worse, you remove the deity from the Lord Jesus Christ and ascribe it to an unknowable god whom you call Yahweh and Father.
In doing so, you believe that the Lord Jesus Christ is only a man, and the so called true god Yahweh made this man Jesus a lord (with a little 'l').
You said, 'The From Whom and the For Whom speak about God the Father Who brought things into being, and the Through Whom speaks about the Son Whom the Father used to do this.'
Yes Brenda, there is only ONE GOD and that is the Father (1 Cor. 8:6 and Eph. 4:6).
But that GOD and FATHER is the Lord Jesus Christ !
No Brenda, it's not another one, it's Jesus, (John 10:30 and John 14:9 and Isa. 9:6 and many more)
Ans yes, it is this 'God the Father Who brought ALL things into being' Jesus Christ our Lord (Col.1:15-20 and John 1:3-10).
You need to believe in JESUS ! To believe in another one is the transgression of the first and second commandment of the Lord Jesus Christ.
Brenda, you need to make every effort to believe in the Lord Jesus Christ alone and in NO other.
Every other god is the god of this world (2 Cor. 4:4), regardless what you call him and whatever name and title you give him.
Because millions of people call the Pope of Rome 'Holy Father', but that doesn't make the Pope the Father God.
If they don't call the Lord Jesus Christ Holy Father, then they WILL call the devil Holy Father.
The devil is called the god of this world because most people believe in him (Rev.12:9 and 1 John 5:19 and John 12:19).
Yes, every devil has a Bible, and every devil claims to believe in God and in the Bible, but one thing they do NOT do, they do NOT believe in the Lord Jesus Christ of Nazareth.
But the Lord Jesus knows those who are His.
I do believe in Jesus as my Lord Paul, but I am totally amazed that, no matter how many readers of your blog tell you, you do not appear to believe what Jesus or the scriptures say. You keep saying to me 'you say.....' when I, or others, quote scripture or words that Jesus speaks and yet you do not acknowledge that it is not me that is 'saying' this - IT IS WRITTEN.
You must work out your own salvation, as we all have to. As long as I have no blood on my hands.
No Brenda, the Lord Jesus Christ is NOT your LORD.
You don't even know what 'Lord' means.
Your LORD is a god called Yahweh and the Lord Jesus Christ is only your little lord, perhaps like 'little lord Fauntleroy'.
I am an ambassador to Jesus Christ and NOT to commentators. I am telling commentators to believe in the Lord Jesus Christ and then they shall be saved.
Brenda, I have been telling you that I believe the Scriptures, therefore when you quote the Scriptures, I agree with the Scriptures, but I do not agree with what you believe and teach.
I cannot argue against the Scripture, I argue with the Scriptures and the Spirit of the Lord against error.
So, when the Scriptures said that 'God sent His only Son', you believe exactly the wording of that metaphor.
It seems to me that you cannot distinguish between a metaphor and a reality.
Tell me, is the Lord Jesus Christ the creator of heaven and earth came in flesh (Immanuel God with us) ? God appeared in a body 1 Tim. 3:16 Jesus Christ ?
Well, I don't think that you believe that reality or fact.
Brenda, if you would understand and believe the Scriptures, then you would know that GOD does NOT have a son, but rather that He 'IS' the SON.
There's a big difference between a metaphor and the reality.
Jesus is the Lord God came in the flesh and looked just like one of us and was born just like any other man, and in that sense God is CALLED the Son, (Luke 1:35) "the holy child shall be CALLED the Son of God".
So again, is Jesus the Son of God ? NO ! He is only CALLED the Son of God.
Jesus Christ is the creator of heaven and earth and he is nobody's son, he is only called 'Son' because of His incarnation.
But that does not mean that God did not have a son, He has MANY sons starting first with Adam (Luke 3:38), Abel, Seth, Enosh and all of us who are born again of the Spirit are sons of God.
IT IS WRITTEN !
That the Lord Jesus Christ has NO Father, (Hebrew 7:3) 'without FATHER or MOTHER or GENEALOGY' etc.
It is written that Jesus Christ is the Father, (John 14:9) 'He who has seen Me has seen the Father', (John 10:30) 'I and the Father are ONE', the Prophet Isaiah said, 'His name shall be called the everlasting Father' (Isa.9:6).
It is written that there is ONE God and that is the Father, (1 Cor. 8:6) 'Yet for us is but ONE God the Father', (Eph. 4:6) 'ONE God and Father of all and in all'.
It is written that God alone created the heavens and the earth and everything in it, (Gen. 1:1) 'In the beginning GOD created the heavens and the earth', (Isa. 44:24) ' Thus says the Lord your Redeemer, and the one who has formed you in the womb, I the Lord, am the maker of all things, stretching out the heavens by Myself and spreading out the earth all ALONE.'
It is written that the Lord Jesus Christ created ALL things and nothing came into being apart from the Lord Jesus Christ, (John 1:3) 'ALL things came into being through Him, and apart from Him nothing came into being that has come into being.
It is written (Exodus 20:2) 'YOU shall have NO OTHER gods before Me'.
It is written, (Isa. 45:22) 'Look unto me, and be ye saved, all the ends of the earth: for I am God, and there is no OTHER.'
IT IS WRITTEN !
It is written.
(Isaiah. 44:24) "Thus says the Lord your Redeemer, and the one who has formed you in the womb, I the Lord, am the maker of all things, stretching out the heavens by Myself and spreading out the earth all ALONE."
It is interesting that there are people who think that a god called Jehovah or Yahweh created all things THROUGH a man called Jesus.
As if God was not able to create everything by Himself and REDEEM His people by Himself.
Who is the REDEEMER, the one who has formed us in the womb ?
If that is NOT the Lord Jesus Christ, then who is it ?
And who is the one who claims to be the LORD ?
If that is NOT the Lord Jesus Christ, then who is that 'LORD' ?
And who is that who stretched out the heaven ALL ALONE ?
Are you saying that there is another one there, perhaps an unknowable GOD who stretched out the heavens ?
NO ! There is not a GOD called Father and another GOD called Son and third GOD called the Holy Spirit.
There is only ONE GOD and that is the Lord Jesus Christ ! He alone holds the TITLES Father, Son and Holy Spirit.
The Lord Jesus Christ made everything ALL by Himself. There was NO other God called Father to tell Him what to do, and neither was there a God called Jehovah or Yahweh who was spreading out the earth THROUGH Jesus.
Isaiah 44:24,
Even though it is clearly written that the Lord God made everything ALL ALONE. He did NOT make the world THROUGH someone else.
Yet, there are intelligent Christian people who believe that God made the world THROUGH another one called Jesus.
If that is not the power of Satan to deceive even the elect, then what is ?
The same group of people do not believe what it is written in the Scriptures that God appeared in a body (1 Tim. 3:16).
They believe the metaphoric language of the Scriptures, that God SENT someone else, a so called Son. (John 3:17), 'For God did not sent the Son into the world to judge the world,' (Gal.4:4), 'But when the fullness of time came, God sent forth His Son, born of a woman, born under the Law,' etc.
Well, did God appeared in a body (1 Tim 3:16) ? Yes of course, it is Jesus Christ who appeared in a body, born of a woman (Gal. 4:4). God with us Immanuel (Mat. 1:23).
So then, did God SEND somebody else ? No He did NOT ! He came by Himself.
John 3:17 and Galatians 4:4 and many other passages use metaphoric language to bear testimony to the truth which is Jesus Christ (John 14:6) our ONLY God (Jude 1:25).
Paul,
In the beginning, all things came into being, by the Word of God. When the Words of God are spoken, it is Truth and it is Glorified, because of it's source.
During creation, when the Word of God was spoken, it became manifested, in the created things of this universe and this world.
Before the world was, God knew and spoke the truth, that his creation would need a savior. God spoke andthe future savior was glorified. It does mean that Y'shua was physically there, during that time.
John tries to set the stage for us, in John 1:1. In the beginning, was the Word of God, bringing all things into being. That's all. Don't be guilty of reading your doctrine into it. I will try to put it very simply. God Spoke, it came to be. When God Spoke and because it is the ultimate truth, it was inevitable, regardless if it happen that very moment or 10,000 years in the future. Unfortunately, you cannot comprehend that. John 1:5 talks about people, like you. You need to open your eyes.
In John 1:14, the inevitable occurred. Salvation is manifested, in the man, Y'shua, Jesus, just as the Word of God proclaimed, in the beginning. Because God spoke of our salvation, before the beginning of time and space, it was inevitable, therefore glorified. The man Y'shua, Jesus, is a direct creation of God, in the same way, Adam was. The difference is that Y'shua, Jesus, was obedient, unto death and took the rightful place of the first Adam. Adam and Y'shua, Jesus were Sons of God, with direct lineage.
Now read John 17 and you'll hopefully understand. Y'shua completed the work, that God gave him to do. The enivitable has occurred and the Glory of God, the Glory from the beginning, fell upon Y'shua, Jesus.
If you would only take your denominational and doctrinal blinders off and start from the beginning, without bias, you have a chance to understand. If you don't, then you will remain a child of darkness, because you refuse to see the truth and understand. By the way, darkness here does not mean evil. No. It means you can't see the light, because of closed eyes. Those who have eyes, let them see what the Spirit says unto the Body of the Messiah.
1 Corinthians ch. 15 vs. 45 - 49 speaks quite clearly of the difference between the two Adams, and the reason the second Adam was created. :-
'Thus it is written, “The first man Adam became a living being”; the last Adam became a life-giving spirit. But it is not the spiritual that is first but the natural, and then the spiritual. The first man was from the earth, a man of dust; the second man is from heaven. As was the man of dust, so also are those who are of the dust, and as is the man of heaven, so also are those who are of heaven. Just as we have borne the image of the man of dust, we shall also bear the image of the man of heaven.
The first Adam was a man whom God formed from dust' , the second Adam, Jesus, was a man born of God's Spirit (no mention of dust).
Keith,
Well my friend, a lot of Christian people believe that, just as you have said.
But in actual fact, that is faaar from the truth.
Yes, God spoke, but that God is the Lord Jesus Christ who spoke and not an unknown god, or a god called Yahweh.
The Lord Jesus Christ is the Alpha and the Omega, the first and the last, but in your explanation the Lord Jesus Christ is NOT the Alpha (the first). In your comment, it is an unknown god whom you are calling Yahweh who is supposed to have created the world through a man called Y'shua.
Can you see it ? You have removed the Lord Jesus from the first place (Alpha) into a secondary (a lower) place, perhaps into some kind of a so called 'WORD'.
Keith, the Lord Jesus is NOT a word, He is the GOD who spoke the word in Genesis 1:3, there is a big difference between those two statements.
John 1:1 is saying the same as I am saying, it uses metaphoric language. Yes, I know that you don't like that.
But John 1:5 says it clearly, that the Lord JESUS is the light of this world and everyone who does not believe in Jesus does not COMPREHEND it.
Well, that's you my friend.
You need to believe in the Lord Jesus Christ and NOT in a man called Y'shua and in an unknowable god called Yahweh.
Yes Brenda, but what are you trying to say ?
Remember, I believe every word of the Scriptures, therefore I cannot reason against the Scriptures.
You said, 'the second Adam, Jesus, was a man born of God's Spirit (no mention of dust).'
I don't have a big problem with that statement.
Except, when you think that Jesus was a MAN born of God's Spirit.
In that sense the Lord Jesus was NOT a man born of some kind of God's Spirit.
The Lord Jesus is God who came in the likeness of a man and born through a woman.
Remember, He said, 'You thought that I was just like YOU; I will reprove you and state the case in order before your eyes.' (Ps. 50:21).
Brenda, you need to portray that God came in the likeness of a man Jesus Christ and not the other way around, that God sent a man Jesus.
This comment has been removed by the author.
Paul,
There are seven levels of scriptural interpretation. All agree with the literal, which is the first level of understanding. This was given to us by Y'shua, Jesus, himself, the one that you wish to elevate above his father, who is the one and only God. You are denying what Y'shua, Jesus, said, You deny the God inwhich you say you believe. Denying the Light is exactly what John 1 tells to expect from children of the darkness.
Paul,
it is scripture that says these things:-
John ch. 1 v. 14 states:-
'The Word became flesh and made His dwelling among us. We have seen His glory, the glory of the one and only Son from the Father, full of grace and truth.…'
verses 12 and 13 state:-
'But to all who did receive Him, to those who believed in His name, He gave the right to become children of God— children born not of blood, nor will of the flesh, nor will of man, but born of God.'
It describes how we can only become children of God (born of His Spirit), through receiving Jesus, God's Son (born of God's Spirit), who was the first born of all creation, the first of many brethren.
Keith,
You said, 'There are seven levels of scriptural interpretation.'
Do you mean from bad to worse, or from good to bad ? :-)
You said, 'You deny the God in which you say you believe.'
How is that possible ?
I say that I believe in only ONE God and that God is the Lord Jesus Christ. How then can I deny Him ?
Brenda,
You quoted, 'verses 12 and 13 state:-
'But to all who did receive Him, to those who believed in His name, He gave the right to become children of God— children born not of blood, nor will of the flesh, nor will of man, but born of God.'
Yes, that's true and I wish that you would believe that, but I know that you don't believe.
You believe that you can become a child of God by believing in Jesus.
Even the very verse denies that. Just read it slowly and think.
It's not rocket science Brenda, it is a simple belief in the Lord Jesus Christ and abandon your other god called Yahweh.
It is that false god Yahweh which has become a stumbling block to you.
Paul,
The seven levels of scriptural interpretation, given to us by Y'shua, Jesus, himself, are:
Literal
Metaphoric
Symbolic
Modeled
Moralistic
Legalistic
Prophetic
As you advance through all be levels, one thing is clear. You must have an anchor into reality. That anchor is Y'shua,Jesus, the Word of God. Your tether is the Spirit of God and the gift of discernment. You cannot look at the Word of God, metaphorically, and ignore the literal interpretation. Again, this is the example that Y'shua, Jesus gave us. That's what I meant when I say you deny the "God", that you say you Believe in when you ignore his example
'Jesus said unto her, I am the resurrection, and the life: he that believeth in me, though he were dead, yet shall he live:'
That is right Paul, Whoever believes in Jesus, though he were dead, yet shall he live.
I believe in Jesus, the Word of God made flesh.
some of the first words He spoke to me after I was born again was:- 'If you love Me, you will keep My commandments. And I will ask the Father, and He will give you another Advocate to be with you forever—…,' (John ch. 14 vs. 15 and 16.) and that is what He did. Praise His lovely name.
Keith, I have a simple faith and belief in the Lord Jesus Christ and I think that everyone who claims to believe in God ought to believe the Scriptures LITERALLY and NOT metaphoric.
It is the literal meaning which profits the reader or hearer. The metaphoric is supposed to support the literal. It should not change the literal into a contradiction.
Either the Lord God came to dwell with us, or the Lord God sent someone else.
The Lord God came to dwell with us, means that the Lord Jesus Christ LITERALLY came to dwell with us, that is not metaphoric.
But to say that God sent His only begotten Son is METAPHORIC.
It is for those who do not know God so that they may believe in the Lord Jesus Christ.
A metaphoric statement does NOT mean that God SENT somebody else, a so called Son.
Metaphoric is NOT literal, and to think so is error.
You think that God SENT a man Y'shua, but the real God (Yahweh) stayed back and does nothing, or seemingly instruct a man by the name of Y'shua to do things.
But that is metaphorically incorrect and literally not true.
Brenda,
You said, 'some of the first words He spoke to me after I was born again was:- 'If you love Me, you will keep My commandments. And I will ask the Father, and He will give you another Advocate to be with you forever—…,' (John ch. 14 vs. 15 and 16.) and that is what He did. Praise His lovely name.'
Yes, but why then don't you keep His commandments ?
You are transgressing the first and the second commandment of the Lord and therefore all the others.
The first command is that you should have NO OTHER GOD beside the Lord your God.
I'll ask you, who is the Lord your God ?
Yahweh ?
Certainly NOT ! That god is not even mentioned in the Scriptures.
I think that it is the god of this world (2 Cor. 4:4) because the whole world has gone after him (John 12:19) and they worship him, and you do exactly the same.
Brenda, you need to repent and believe in the Lord Jesus Christ. Anything else is worthless and useless religion.
Do you think that the Lord Jesus Christ had to ask another person or a god called the Father ?
So that he could send another god, (a third god) an Advocate to be with you ?
Brenda, what kind of a god is that ?
It seems to me that you sufferer from the same problem as Keith does. You can't distinguish between a metaphor and literal.
Nevertheless, it is required from you that you believe in the Lord Jesus Christ alone and abandon ALL your other gods, otherwise you transgress the first commandment of the Lord.
How can you love the Lord if you believe and worship another lord ?
Paul,
I believe that the Lord is speaking about doing what He commands me to do as I work out my salvation, not keeping the 10 commandments. We have to go through a process as we learn and mature in the Lord. First there is the milk of the Word and then the strong meat. He was telling me to act on the Word He would speak to me, not just be a hearer of it. His Word is written, and this is how He has spoken to me for over thirty years as I grow in the Lord and endeavour to keep His Words.
Jesus said regarding this in John ch. 14 vs. 23-26, when He was asked how He would manifest Himself to those who love Him:-
'If anyone loves me, he will keep my word, and my Father will love him, and we will come to him and make our home with him. Whoever does not love me does not keep my words. And the word that you hear is not mine but the Father's who sent me.
These things I have spoken to you while I am still with you. But the Helper, the Holy Spirit, whom the Father will send in my name, he will teach you all things and bring to your remembrance all that I have said to you.'
Of course it is required that I believe in the Lord Jesus He was the Word of God made flesh and the only mediator between man and God, as Jesus says Himself in:- 'And the word that you hear is not mine but the Father's who sent me.'
Yes Brenda, I know what you say is true and I don't doubt your sincerity.
When the Lord Jesus said that He will manifest Himself to those who love Him, that means that He will make Himself KNOWN to them.
But I think that the Lord Jesus did NOT make Himself known to you, otherwise you would believe in Him.
You cannot serve two masters, just as much as you cannot love two lords. But for us there should be ONE Lord, and if that Lord is not the Lord Jesus Christ then it is a false lord, an impostor the devil.
Brenda, the Lord Jesus said that the way is narrow and only few are those who find it, therefore you need to make every effort to enter the narrow way.
If the Lord Jesus would have made Himself known to you, then you would know for certain that He is the Lord God Almighty, the Alpha and the Omega, the first and the last, the beginning and the end and that beside the Lord Jesus is NO other God.
And it would be impossible for you to believe in a god called Yahweh and demote the Lord of glory to a mere man.
And neither would you be in conflict with me, for I am His ambassador and the words that you hear are not mine but from my Father who sent me to tell you.
To work out your salvation is not complicated Brenda. It's simply believing in the Lord Jesus Christ.
The Lord Jesus has not given us a task which is to difficult to do, even the little children can do that.
But the scholars and the wise guys think that eternal life is hidden in the Scriptures and is only for those who diligently study the Scriptures.
Jesus lifted up His eyes and said, 'I praise thee O Father that thou hast hidden these things from the wise and the intelligent and gave it to the little children.'
Brenda, you have enough knowledge of the Scriptures to know that you need to turn to Jesus Christ with all your heart and forsake ALL other gods.
Salvation is today, do not harden your heart as those Israelites did in the wilderness, and all of them perished, except Joshua and Caleb.
Remember, they were Israelites whom the Lord Jesus brought out of the kingdom of darkness.
That is right Paul,
it is not complicated to work out my salvation, I just have to act on the Word spoken to me daily through the Holy Spirit. I am part of the body of Christ, the church, (which is not a building or denomination), having my mind renewed in Him. I love the One Whom God has made my Lord, and have the peace that is promised to those who are in Him as I work out my salvation and endeavour to learn God's ways. I hope you have that peace too Paul.
Yes Brenda, but you need to believe in the Lord Jesus Christ alone and in no other.
What I was saying is, that salvation is only in the Lord Jesus Christ and in no other Name.
Not in Yahweh and not in Jehovah or any other name or spirit or whatever.
You said, 'I love the One Whom God has made my Lord,'
Tell me, which God made Jesus your Lord ?
Paul,
just look into the scriptures and agree with them and with what Jesus says regarding His Father and everything else He says, not just one scripture which you call a metaphor. That is where you find your answers, although you do not appear to believe them.
Paul,
You said, "I have a simple faith and belief in the Lord Jesus Christ and I think that everyone who claims to believe in God ought to believe the Scriptures LITERALLY and NOT metaphoric."
And yet, you continue to put the metaphoric interpretation ahead of the literal. You continue to say one thing and do another.
I love you, brother, but you are out of touch with what the Word is saying to you.
Paul,
You said,"You think that God SENT a man Y'shua, but the real God (Yahweh) stayed back and does nothing, or seemingly instruct a man by the name of Y'shua to do things."
This is another problem of yours, my brother. You don't listen. We have never said that. You are so use to lashing out at people, that you no longer listen and comprehend what they are saying. Therefore, let me state it again.
1. God is God, there is no other.
2. God's power is demonstrated, and represented by what is termed, the Spirit of God. There is no separate entity, known as the Spirit of God. However, there is a dimensionality to God's Spirit, that you and I cannot comprehend, which is so dynamic, it "appears" to be the work of another entity, BUT IT IS NOT.
3. Man sinned and fell from grace. He is now separate from a close relationship with God.
4. Since man sinned, God requires a voluntary, perfect, sin offering, of like kind, for retribution. IE: If man sins, a man must present himself, as a perfect sin offering.
5. Problem: Since man sinned, he was no longer perfect, but didn't change God's requirement, for a perfect sin offering.
6. God stepped in to produce a perfect man, with the Spirit of God dwelling within in. That would be Y'shua, Jesus.
7. Knowing the will of God perfectly, but with the free will of a man, Y'shua, Jesus, freely gave his life, as a perfect man sacrifice, for our sins.
You said that we believe that God sent a man. Yes, because that's is what the scriptures say.
"For God so loved the world that He gave His one and only Son, that everyone who believes in Him shall not perish but have eternal life. 17For God did not send His Son into the world to condemn the world, but to save the world through Him. Whoever believes in Him is not condemned, but whoever does not believe is already condemned, because he has not believed in the NAME of God’s one and only SON." John 3:16-18
Notice the name reference.
Now let's look at the Word for Word translation of Isaiah 9:6. and what you miss in the errant English translation.
A human child offspring born.
Son Given.
Dominion Established.
Name Proclaims,
1. God's wonderful and hard to understand act of judgment and redemption.
2. Strong, Brave, Mighty Man, God-Like.
3. Everlasting Father
4. Prince of Peace, Completeness.
Isaiah 9:6 clearly fortells that a human child, who will be the Son, will set up a dominion. His Name Will Proclaim:
1. God's wonderful and hard to understand act of judgment and redemption.
2. He will be a Strong, Brave, Mighty Man, God-Like.
3. Everlasting Salvation, Father. Y'shua, Jesus, literally means YHWH SAVES.
4. Head Overseer of Peace, Completeness. Y'shua is administer our salvation.
I hope this was enlightening, to you. God has put it all there for you to search out. God wants you to search out a matter, that he has hidden from everyone, except the Remnant of God. Are you of the remnant, or are you going to continue chasing down and supporting man made doctrines? The ball is in your court, my friend.
Yes Brenda, just look into the Scriptures and believe it, Hebrews 7:3 "Without father, without mother, without genealogy, having neither beginning of days nor end of life; but made like unto the Son of God, he remains a priest continually."
This is what the Scriptures said about the Lord Jesus Christ and you are supposed to believe what the Scriptures said about the Lord Jesus Christ.
Now, what does the truth say about that ?
ONLY God alone does not have a father !
Why does God not have a father ? Simply, because He IS the Father.
(Hebr. 7:3) declares the Lord Jesus Christ to be the Lord God. NO no no Brenda, not THREE gods, but only one, Jesus Christ.
ONLY God alone does not have a mother !
(Hebr. 7:3) is speaking about the Lord Jesus Christ. Who is made like unto a Son of God ? Obviously that is the Lord Jesus Christ.
The Lord Jesus always denied that Mary and Joseph were His mother and father.
ONLY God alone has no genealogy !
Does the Lord Jesus Christ have a genealogy ?
(Hebr. 7:3) says He does not have a genealogy.
The Genealogy of Jesus, Luke 3:23 "As was SUPPOSED, the son of Joseph."
Because God was clothed in flesh (or became in the appearance a man), therefore God had to be traced back to Adam, through the line of the elect, God's sons.
Only God alone had NO beginning !
Every son has a beginning and an end.
But the Lord Jesus Christ is NOT a son, He is only CALLED 'Son' because of His incarnation (Luke 1:35).
Jesus is God with us (Mat. 1:23) Emmanuel, and there is no other true God (1 John 5:20).
Yes my friend, I'm listening very carefully to what you are saying.
Keith, "God is God" is a nonsensical statement. It means nothing !
Tell me, how do you know what I can comprehend ?
Because you say that you don't understand, that does not mean that I do not understand.
Keith, If I would not understand, then I certainly would not speak and explain.
The reason I speak and explain is that you might believe in the Lord Jesus Christ and in NO other, in no other god.
It's not Rocket science my brother.
Obviously, IF Jesus is NOT the Spirit, and Jesus is NOT the Father, and Jesus is NOT God, then someone else is God.
You are saying that a god called Yahweh is God.
God did NOT send a man to be a sacrifice for our sins, it was God Himself who came in the form of a man to sacrifice Himself for our sins. There is a big difference in those two explanations.
Point 3, Jesus is the everlasting Father Isaiah 9:6, and no my friend, it's not Yahweh, it's Jesus.
The name Yahweh is NOT in the Scriptures, in the Scriptures he is called the devil, that is because they don't want to believe in Jesus, they rather believe in the god of this world (2 Cor.4:4) which is the devil.
But you ought to believe in the Lord Jesus Christ and not in a god of your own making.
Paul,
Let's be perfectly clear where you stand. Yes or no, Are you are saying that Yahweh, when referenced in the Bible, is Satan?
Paul,
and if you read vs. 15-28 of Hebrews ch. 7 it explains much more of Jesus as High Priest being compared to Melchizedek:-
'This becomes even more evident when another priest arises in the likeness of Melchizedek, Who has become a priest, not on the basis of a legal requirement concerning bodily descent, but by the power of an indestructible life. For it is witnessed of Him, 'You are a priest forever, after the order of Melchizedek.'
For on the one hand, a former commandment is set aside because of its weakness and uselessness (for the law made nothing perfect); but on the other hand, a better hope is introduced, through which we draw near to God.
And it was not without an oath. For those who formerly became priests were made such without an oath, but this One was made a priest with an oath by the One who said to Him:
'The Lord has sworn and will not change His mind,
'You are a priest forever.’
This makes Jesus the guarantor of a better covenant.
The former priests were many in number, because they were prevented by death from continuing in office, but he holds his priesthood permanently, because he continues forever. Consequently, HE IS ABLE TO SAVE TO THE UTTERMOST THOSE WHO DRAW NEAR TO GOD THROUGH HIM, SINCE HE ALWAYS LIVES TO MAKE INTERCESSION FOR THEM.
For it was indeed fitting that we should have such a high priest, holy, innocent, unstained, separated from sinners, and EXALTED above the heavens. He has no need, like those high priests, to offer sacrifices daily, first for His own sins and then for those of the people, since He did this once for all when He offered up Himself. For the law appoints men in their weakness as high priests, but the WORD OF THE OATH, which came later than the law, appoints a SON WHO HAS BEEN MADE PERFECT FOREVER.
Keith, I do NOT assume that an entity by the name of Yahweh is God, apart from being a false god. I believe that the Lord JESUS Christ is the true GOD and Yahweh is a false god. The name Yahweh is NOT mentioned in the Bible, you are making up a name for a false god.
There is only ONE true God (1 John 5:20) Jesus Christ, and ANY OTHER god is the devil.
Simply, if it is NOT Jesus, then it is the devil.
No my friend, there are not two Gods, Jesus and someone else, or a trinity of three gods, and neither is Jesus a mere man who created the heavens and the earth.
Brenda, Israel had no priesthood of the order of Melchizedek and neither did they have in the Levitical priesthood a high priest by the name of Melchizedek.
That priesthood belong to God Himself and not to men.
It was Jesus Christ who established that order.
You said, 'since He did this once for all when He offered up Himself.'
Note, He offered up HIMSELF, He did not offered up someone else, a son or a man. Just read it properly and think about.
Jesus is NOT a sinner, He was NOT offered up for His sins, but only for the sins of the people.
EVERY man is a sinner, except GOD is NOT a sinner, therefore Jesus Christ is God who became a man and offered up Himself for our sins.
Hebrews 7:3 said, "Without father," That means exactly as it said, that Jesus has NO father.
God does NOT have a father Brenda, and the Lord Jesus is that God, that's why the Scriptures said that Jesus has no father or mother or genealogy etc.
If Jesus would have a father, then Jesus would not be the FIRST (Alpha). A father is always the FIRST (Alpha), and Jesus is the FIRST (Rev. 1:17-18), and for us is but one God the Father (1 Cor. 8:6) and that is Jesus Christ our Lord and only God and saviour (Jude 1:25).
Therefore, any other god is the devil.
Brenda, there is no other way, either you believe in Jesus or in the devil.
But as it is, you don't believe in Jesus, you believe in another one and you call him Yahweh.
You are worshiping another god, a false god and you need to repent and worship Jesus Christ who made the heavens and the earth (Rev. 14:7).
If you will not worship Jesus Christ, then, like all the people you will worship the beast (Rev. 13:8).
Now, the beast is the father of Cain who was born of the evil one (1 John 3:12), and he is the father of all who do not believe in the Lord Jesus Christ.
It still amazes me that an intelligent man, such as yourself, would turn a blind eye, to the original text, from which your errant and biased English Bible is translated.
It is not me you are arguing with Paul,
it is the written Word taken from the book that you claim to believe in. It was you who quoted one verse from Hebrews ch. 7. I just quoted several other verses from the same chapter that you quoted from.
You just keep saying the same thing all the time, there is nothing that those who God calls to Jesus could really learn from your doctrine as everything you write can be corrected by scripture to produce the whole truth of the written Word.
The choice is ours, whether we believe what man says or what God's timeless word speaks to us in its fullness.
Keith,
'intelligence' means nothing to God as he has chosen the foolish things to confound the 'wise' and the weak things of the world to shame the strong, as it states in 1 Corinthians ch. 1 v. 27.
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Hi Brenda,
I agree with what you say. I chose the word intelligence, because Paul obviously lacks the spiritual discernment, promised to believers, when they receive the gift of the Holy Spirit. Paul's god is his homemade doctrine, borne out of his intelligence and ego and the need to be leader of a cult, where he can say, "I was first, now follow me."
I agree totally with you Keith,
and true believers only follow the One Who speaks God's truths as it is Written - Jesus, God's Son.
No Keith, there is NO original text.
I find that hard to understand that you are able to believe such nonsense.
Every scholar of the Scriptures will tell you that there is NO original text. NO my friend, not even one text !
To know that, you need to have natural discernment and not spiritual.
If there would only be one original text, I surely would know.
Remember, I claim that I personally know the author of the Scriptures.
Keith, you said, 'there is a dimensionality to God's Spirit, that you and I cannot comprehend, which is so dynamic, it "appears" to be the work of another entity, BUT IT IS NOT.'
And you claim to have spiritual discernment and can't comprehend that ?
Brenda, if it is not you I am arguing with, then with whom do I argue ?
Is it with your higher self ? Or perhaps is it with a second person of your dual personality ?
Brenda, you need to explain what the verse of the Scripture means.
Don't only quote a Bible verse, I'm a big boy, I can read the Bible by myself.
The meaning of the Scriptures is obviously different to you than it is to me.
When the Bible says, 'God', you believe that it is an unknowable god called Yahweh; but I believe and testify that this God of the Bible is the Lord Jesus Christ.
Can you see the difference ?
When the Bible says, 'the Son of God', you believe that this unknowable god called Yahweh had a Son who is a man; but I believe that it is a metaphoric statement, meaning that God IS the Son, and that 'God' was born into His own creation and therefore He is only CALLED the Son (metaphorically).
Can you see that difference Brenda ?
There are many more of those examples.
It is not possible to amalgamate those two perspectives. One is true, the other is false and you have chosen to believe the false perspective which will always lead you into greater error.
Listen to what the Spirit says to you Brenda (Rev. 2:7).
The letter kills but the Spirit gives life.
Paul,
You said, "And you claim to have spiritual discernment and can't comprehend that ?"
Once again, your comment shows your lack of Spiritual Discernment and inability to understand what is written. The Bible and I have always said that Spiritual Discernment relates to the scriptures, not understanding God's actual make up.
As for the original text, your errant English Bible was translated from a 5th century version of the Masoretic Text, which matches, word for word, what is available from the Dead Sea Scrolls, which is dated to the time that Y'shua walked upon this earth. Also, there are verses, in your errant English Bible, that do not exist, in the Dead Sea Scrolls or Masoretic Text. They were simple made up, in your errant English Bible. Open your eyes and ears, Man.
Now, who's believing in nonsense? A Biblical Scholar and True Believer, such as I, or an ostrich, who sticks his head in the ground, with his man fingers, in his spiritual ears, saying, "Nay, Nay,Nay....I can't hear you."
We shall agree to disagree Paul,
you just keep saying the same things over and over. There is only One teacher through Whom we can come to the knowledge of the truth, and we could go on for ever and ever disagreeing over the same things. You put the same things in your posts all the time, and really there is not much to discuss in them.
Search the scriptures to see if what you believe is true.
Yahweh, Posts His Claim On The Cross
Did you know that when the Romans crucified Y’shua, Jesus, they hung a sign, at the head of the cross, on which it said, Y’shua HaNazarei Vemelekh HaY’hudim, which means Y’shua (Jesus) of Nazareth, King of the Jews? When you investigate Roman crucifixions, you will find that it was a common practice, to hang a description of the criminal offense. This sign would have typically placed in a vertical orientation, in order to be read quickly, at a glance. However, once the sign was erected, the Jewish Leadership was in an uproar and attempted to have it rewritten to Y’shua Said He Was The King Of The Jews. Why? Well, a closer look, at the first letters, of sign, reveals the source of the Jews objection. For on the sign, it revealed the power behind Y’shua, YHVH. In English, it reads YAHWEH.
Yes that's right Keith, but they only put a sign on the cross of Jesus and not on the other two crosses.
Perhaps, the governor could find no charge, except something which is not a criminal offence.
To be a King is no criminal offence, but interesting to the Jews it was and is, that is because He claimed to be the Lord God the creator of heaven and earth.
Remember, God came to His own, and His own received Him not, but as many as received Him, to them He gave the power to become the sons of God.
I think that the Jews have suffered from the time of the crucifixion to this very day, because they said, "His blood shall be on us and our children !" (Mat. 27:25), and history will tell you the punishment of the Jews.
They said, "We have NO king but Caesar." (John 19:14)
You see, God is not their King but Caesar is.
If the Jews would repent and turn to the Lord Jesus Christ, then they would also be saved and their reproach would be removed. But they are a stubborn and a stiff-necked people just as the Scriptures said.
It amazes me, that people have so much resistance to accept the Lord of glory Jesus Christ as their King.
The Lord Jesus is the King of Kings, and of course the Lord of Lords, and there is no other King or Lord who is GOD but Jesus alone.
No my friend, it's NOT Yahweh ;-) JESUS !
And 'YHWH' does NOT read Yahweh, NOT in any language.
Note, it has no vowels. No language in the whole world can pronounce those four letters. It's not possible, just admit it, and don't try to pervert those four letters, it is the Name of God who had to be revealed at the appropriate time (Mat. 1:25) = JESUS ! :-)
Paul,
I find it interesting that, even though there was most likely a sign hung up on the crosses of the two prisoners, next to Y'ahua, Jesus, the Holy Spirit decided to edit it out of the text. He does that in quite a few places, to create a model, to you and me. I do like the model that the two criminals had no criminal offense attached to them, while an offense was placed upon Y'shua, Jesus, where there shouldnt be.
As for your comment, concerning Jesus being our father, I have shown you many places, inside the Bible and outside, where that is just not so, as you lay it out. In a nutshell, Y'shua, Jesus, is 100% man and 100% God, which could be logically deduced by the following facts.
1. God has never died, God never died, God will never die.
2. God cannot be in the presence of sin, little alone be made sIn.
Yet, Y'Shua, Jesus, was made sin. died on the cross and was resurrected three days later by God.
As for the enunciation of YHWH, we have no definitive information to dispute the actual pronunciation of YHWH. Your comment ,that it has no vowels, is a little misleading. The Hebrew language has no vowels. However, I have shown you in the past, that the priest knew how to pronounce the name of God. As for the proper enunciation, I believe that we will find out that it is pronounced, Yahehyeh, but it will be revealed soon
Keith,
You said, 'Jesus is 100% man and 100% God'.
I don't think that you believe that.
If you would believe that, then you could not believe that another one by the name of Yahweh is also God.
Do you think that there are two Gods ? Jesus 100% God and Yahweh 100% God ?
One plus another one equals TWO, (1+1= 2). Are you sure that there is not a third one who is also a 100% God ?
Most Christians believe that there are THREE persons and each is 100% God.
Tell me, how can Jesus be 100% God and needed to be resurrect by another one from the dead?
If Jesus needed another one to resurrect Him, He would not be 100% God.
No my friend, absolutely no, God is NOT two persons and neither is He three persons.
The truth is that the Lord Jesus Christ is GOD alone and there is NO other God beside Him, He alone is God and there is no other (Isa. 43:10).
You need to believe in Jesus Christ and the Scriptures.
The Lord Jesus made it clear while He was lived among us that He will raise Himself up from the grave on the third day (John 2:19).
It makes sense, if there is NO other God next to Jesus, then He obviously had to resurrect Himself, otherwise He would not be 100% God. Therefore the Scriptures is correct, that God raised Jesus from the dead (Acts 4:10).
Or perhaps, do you think that there is a third person who raised Jesus from the dead, the Holy Spirit (Rom. 8:11) ?
Or is there a fourth person the Father who raised Jesus from the dead (Gal. 1:1) ?
Can you see Keith, it gets very ridiculous with that kind of unintelligent reasoning.
The Scriptures are written for those who believe in the Lord Jesus Christ, so that they would believe that Jesus is God, and that He is the Father, Son and the Holy Spirit.
Yes Keith, God can and did die on the cross. I have explained that to you many times.
And God can be in the presence of sin.
What do you think, is God hiding somewhere when you sin ? Of course not! He is rebuking you to your face at any time.
Concerning YHWH, those four letters have no vowels, you can NOT say it ! In fact nobody can say it. Just try to say it, then you will see.
In the Old Testament nobody knew God's Name and neither could they say it. God was known under the title 'God or Lord' till the New Testament when God caused Himself to be born into His own creation as a man in the likeness of Adam (man), just as the Prophets of old have foretold that He would be born though a virgin and His Name would be given Immanuel (God with us), 'JESUS' (Mat. 1:23 and 21).
Keith, I know His Name and so should you. His Name is NOT Yahweh and neither Jehovah.
His Name is JESUS ! And NO other name.
You said, "Tell me, how can Jesus be 100% God and needed to be resurrect by another one from the dead?
If Jesus needed another one to resurrect Him, He would not be 100% God."
That's a very good questiion and one that you need to answer, to fully understand who Y'Shua, Jesus was and is and always will be.
God's Law requires a perfect sacrifice for the retribution of sins. Since Man sinned, man has to die for his sins. The problem was that there was no perfect man. Therefore, God provided a perfect man. However, since all men have sinned and fallen short of the Glory of God, God started from scratch and created a perfect Adam, in the womb of a virgin woman according to scripture, free from the sin gene. That man was Y'Shua, Jesus. 100% Man. That's body and mind, which makes up the flesh side. However, there is another side, that is the spiritual side.
To live is life perfectly, the Man had to process the perfect knowledge of God's will. Therefore, God dwelled within Him. 100% God.
For Y'Shua, Jesus, to be a perfect replacement, he had to have a free will to choose or refuse Gods way. This was shown in the garden, when he prayed, " Not my will, but thy will be done."
For your theory, to be correct, God must talk to himself, be schizophrenic at times, be conflicted at times, be able to die, be made sin, I can go on, but all is against his natu
Well, that was a good attempt my friend :-) But not good enough.
If Jesus is 100% God, and the one who raised Him from the dead is also 100% God, then you have TWO gods.
But Jesus said, 'Hear O Israel, the Lord your God is ONE' ! and not two.
At the same time it causes you not to believe in Jesus. Remember, Jesus said that He raised Himself from the dead (John 2:19). Then why don't you believe Him ?
No my friend, the Lord Jesus is not schizophrenic. He had to swear by Himself (Hebr. 6:13) and pray to Himself (John 17: …..) because there was NO other God to swear and pray by.
You need to ask yourself, why did Jesus pray, if He is 100% God ?
Are you saying that one of your 100% gods was a sinner and needed to pray to another god who is also 100% god ?
Remember, only sinners need to pray, but surely not one who is 100% God.
Keith, all that confusion comes because you are unwilling to believe in the Lord Jesus Christ.
That's correct. The Lord God is one....and then there's the Messiah. It's a simple and scripturally based concept. Not two gods talking to each other as you are espousing. Not a god that talks or prays to himself as you espouse. Not a god that is conflicted, not knowing and even questioning his own will at times. No!!!! God is one. The Messiah is one. Not a Father losing his mind and questioning himself, as you espouse.
You are also correct. You must believe in the Lord Y'shua. But that is not enough. You must get to know him. I believe that you definitely believe in Y'shua, but you definitely do not know him. Y'shua is the Messiah, a faithful son, who willingly sacrificed himself for your sins, according to the will of his Father.
No Keith, the Messiah IS the Lord God who is ONE, plainly, the Messiah is God.
Messiah means that God who is Spirit (John 4:24) came in the flesh and dwelt among us.
Messiah means that God caused Himself to be born into His own creation, God with us Immanuel.
Who do you think created the heavens and the earth ?
The Bible says that it is the Lord Jesus Christ who created everything and nothing came into being apart from Him.
But you believe that this unknowable god sent a man to do a job he couldn't do himself. How pathetic is that ?
The Bible teaches that God came by Himself for the redemption of men and to fulfill the requirement of the law etc.
The Lord Jesus was speaking metaphorically from the position of a man. Remember, God became a man, and from that position He had to pray, speak and act like a man, Just as He has said, that he was speaking FIGURATIVELY (metaphoric) about the Father (John 16:25). Obviously, if He IS the Father, He had to speak figuratively about the Father (who is Himself).
You must believe in the Lord Jesus Christ and NOT in a Lord Y'shua. Y'shua is NOT the Messiah, Jesus Christ of Nazareth is the Messiah, just read your Bible and believe it.
Isaiah said that the Messiah is the Mighty God, and that is Jesus Christ and not Y'shua.
Isaiah also said that the Messiah is the everlasting Father, and that is Jesus Christ and not Y'shua and no it's not Yahweh either, it's simply the Lord Jesus Christ.
Paul,
Over on my blog, you asked a very good question. "How does God know the future? Does he have a crystal ball?"
The first step to answering that question, for yourself, is understanding the multidimensionality of God. Understanding the multidimensionality of God will also allow you to see how Y'Shua, Jesus, can be 100% man while being 100% God. Once again, opening your eyes to The truth of the Scriptures is your next step. I hope and pray you take it. God is waiting for you.
Keith,
God is Spirit (John 4:24) and is omnipresent with NO dimensions. A Spirit does not have dimensions. Only in the flesh God had three dimensions, that is the Lord Jesus just like any other man.
You still have not given me an answer to my question about the crystal ball. I think that you are an intelligent brother, therefore give me an intelligent answer :-)
You don't believe that the Lord Jesus Christ is 100% God.
If you would believe that, then your other god Yahweh would be a false god.
Remember, there is only one true God and any other god is a false god. There are not two gods who each are 100% God.
Tell me my friend, to which God are you praying ?
Do you pray to a god who is NOT 100% god THROUGH another God who is 100% God ?
Or do you pray to a 100% God THROUGH another 100% God ?
Please tell me, how many 100% gods are there ?
To know God is to believe that Jesus is the Lord God Almighty. Everyone who does not believe that, does not know God.
Jesus said, 'If you do not know that I am He, you will die in your sins' (John 8:24).
It is the Lord Jesus Christ who is waiting for you my friend.
Whosoever shall believe in the Lord Jesus Christ shall be saved.
Paul,
the five verses following John 8.24 hold the words that Jesus uses to describe exactly Who He is:-
'So they said to him, “Who are you?” Jesus said to them, 'Just what I have been telling you from the beginning. I have much to say about you and much to judge, but he who sent me is true, and I declare to the world what I have heard from him. They did not understand that he had been speaking to them about the Father. So Jesus said to them, 'When you have lifted up the Son of Man, then you will know that I am he, and that I do nothing on my own authority, but speak just as the Father taught me. And He who sent me is with me. He has not left me alone, for I always do the things that are pleasing to him.'
Where Jesus says that the One Who sent Him is with Him, He is very obviously saying that the Father is with Him, and the way God the Father was with Jesus was in Spirit, just as that same Spirit is with us when we too are born of it. That does not make us God, it makes us children of God.
Yes that's right Brenda, they did not understand that Jesus was speaking about the Father and neither do you.
Jesus said , 'He who sent Me is true'.
Please ask yourself, is the Lord Jesus TRUE ?
The Scripture said in 1 John 5:20 that Jesus is the TRUE God and eternal life, and in John 14:6 Jesus claims to be the TRUTH.
Only God is TRUE and all men are liars.
Brenda, it is God who appeared in a body (1 Tim. 3:16), that is the Lord Jesus, and from the position of a man He spoke metaphorically just as He said in (John 16:25).
There wasn't another person called the Father who was with Jesus Brenda. No ! It's metaphoric language meaning that He is the Father, so when you look at Jesus you are seeing your heavenly Father.
You are confusing metaphors with facts.
To think that the creator of heaven and earth Jesus Christ can do nothing on His own authority is at best ridiculous.
The new birth (born again) experience does not make men children of God, it shows that they were and ARE the children of God. That is a big difference to what you are saying, but obviously you don't know the difference.
If you think you do, then please explain.
Yes Paul,
I do see God when I look at Jesus. That is not in the flesh though, that is in the Spirit, through the written Word. The flesh of Jesus is not on the earth any more, it was sacrificed. Jesus was the Word of God made flesh, who was on this earth to be sacrificed for our sins and now He is seated at the right hand of God making intercession for us (those who believe in Him and the word He speaks).
'What then shall we say to these things? If God is for us, who can be against us? He who did not spare his own Son but gave him up for us all, how will he not also with him graciously give us all things? Who shall bring any charge against God's elect? It is God who justifies. Who is to condemn? Christ Jesus is the one who died—more than that, who was raised—who is at the right hand of God, who indeed is interceding for us.' Romans ch. 8 vs. 31-34
Consequently, he is able to save to the uttermost those who draw near to God through him, since he always lives to make intercession for them. Hebrews ch. 7 v. 25.
Hi Paul, It's the Bible that tells us about Gods multidimensionality. Therfore, to deny his multidimensionality would be to deny the Bible, which you appear to have no problem doing. The Bible tells us that we are restricted to a four dimensional reality, while God inhabits eternity. He enjoys a control over our reality, which includes the dimension of time.
Brenda, how can you see God when you look at Jesus ?
Obviously you don't believe that Jesus is God, you believe that Yahweh is God and Jesus is his Son.
Whether in the flesh or in the spirit you don't believe that Jesus is God.
That is the point we have been debating for a long time.
If you would believe that, then we would be in agreement and have no argument.
Where then is the flesh of Jesus if it is not on the earth ?
Isn't the body of Christ the Church ?
Don't you know that flesh and blood cannot be in the realm of the spirit (heaven).
You said, 'Jesus was the Word of God made flesh, who was on this earth to be sacrificed for our sins and now He is seated at the right hand of God making intercession for us (those who believe in Him and the word He speaks).'
What do you mean by, 'Jesus was the Word of God made flesh' ? And Jesus sitting at the right hand of God ?
Keith,
Where in the Bible does it say that God is multidimensional ?
I think that is a man made doctrine and not from the Word of God.
Paul,
we will never agree while you remain in the Puritan doctrine and all the questions you ask me regarding the written Word you should be asking the Lord, because it is Him you would learn from if you would only believe every Word He speaks.
When you say that flesh and blood can not be in the realm of spirit (Heaven), we the body of Christ on earth have the mind of Christ and (according to scripture) are seated with Him in Heavenly places:-
'But God, being rich in mercy, because of the great love with which He loved us, even when we were dead in our trespasses, made us alive together with Christ—by grace you have been saved— and raised us up with Him and seated us with Him in the Heavenly places in Christ Jesus, so that in the coming ages He might show the immeasurable riches of his grace in kindness toward us in Christ Jesus.' Ephesians ch. 2 vs. 4-7
'For this reason, because I have heard of your faith in the Lord Jesus and your love toward all the saints, I do not cease to give thanks for you, remembering you in my prayers, that the God of our Lord Jesus Christ, the Father of glory, may give you the Spirit of wisdom and of revelation in the knowledge of Him, having the eyes of your hearts enlightened, that you may know what is the hope to which He has called you, what are the riches of his glorious inheritance in the saints, and what is the immeasurable greatness of his power toward us who believe, according to the working of His great might that He worked in Christ when He raised Him from the dead and seated Him at His right hand in the heavenly places, far above all rule and authority and power and dominion, and above every name that is named, not only in this age but also in the one to come. And he put all things under his feet and gave Him as head over all things to the church, which is His body, the fullness of Him who fills all in all.' Ephesians ch. 1 15-23
These scriptures explain all that you have asked. However they will only speak to, and be understood by, those who have been born again of God's Holy Spirit and have the mind of Christ. To the carnal mind they will be foolishness.
Hey Paul. We are four dimensional creatures, body, mind, spirit and soul, created in the image of God. This is backed up in our limited ability to comprehend the fullness of the Love of God, and the Messiah. Ephesians 3:18. Also, the fact that God inhabits a place outside our dimensionality, called eternity, shows that his dimensionality extends beyond ours. Science proves that for the Messiah to be able to pass through the walls of the upper, in his resurrected body, he has to enjoy an existence of, at least, ten dimensions.
Well my friend, I have a simple and uncomplicated understanding of the Lord. I think that we are three dimensional creatures just like the Lord Jesus in the days of His flesh.
Our spirit does not have any dimensions and was dead before we became born again.
Our mind does not have any dimensions and is a part of the soul.
We are created in the image of God, which is Spirit (John 4:24), Soul (Isa. 1:14) and Body Jesus.
(1 Thes. 5:23) we are spirit, soul and body, and only the body has three dimensions.
Sometimes the mind likes to move into the area where there is no reason or rationality and then we end up in futile speculations and last deception.
Through many years of walking closely with my Lord, I have learned to avoid those pitfalls and listen to His voice and compare it to the Scriptures.
Remember, there are the two witnesses, the Spirit and the Word, one without the other is not reliable.
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